Episode 72: Healing Starts Within with Michael James Moise
Transcript
0:06
Hi, I'm Thea Charles, and this is the push or pivot podcast. This podcast has interviews, stories and tools to inspire and guide you to put your fears aside and trust yourself through the push and pivots of your life.
0:35
I'm excited for you to meet our guests, Michael James Moyes. He talks about how 2020 taught him the importance of healing ourselves first. I am so excited today because I have Michael James with us. And he is actually my brother in law. And we always have really great conversations, and I thought it'd be really nice to have him here on the pusher pit. So welcome to the pusher pivot.
1:02
Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. It is a pleasure to be here. Thank you for having me. Thank you.
1:07
Awesome. So
1:10
why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself? I mean, obviously, I know something about you, but what can our listeners know about you, Michael?
1:18
So first things first, you know, one thing I don't like to do is really just like boggle everything down to like certain titles, like, you know, I'm the founder this or I'm like the, you know, I'm the CEO that are so forth. Like, I've been just learning to focus on like, you know, a person, you know, I'm a person, I'm a man, things that have value, you know, brother, friend, all those things, but, um, in terms of speaking in a world where like, from the perspective of like, what am I well known for, or what I believe is, you know, I found the business organic gentlemen, which is geared around personal branding for men and women, that also focuses on education. So we focus on providing enrichment programs, and so forth. And then also like another project from from the business, and it's hiking, meditate, something that me and a couple of my my good friends, we literally founded in 2020. So that just kind of formed to heal outdoors, especially for black communities, in the sense that we are not really seen in the outdoor spectrum. So we created this platform to advance that, you know, advanced black people enjoying the outdoors.
2:41
I love that. And I really like how you lead with who you are as a person rather than title. And that's really awesome. Because I mean, it's true, the way we work in societies, we often feel like, you have to have a title. And then all the other, like, all the other things aren't as important, but being a brother and a friend and speaks to your values. Okay, so 2020 it's been quite a year,
3:07
it has nonetheless, nonetheless. Nonetheless, showed us a lot. For sure. Yeah, I'd
3:15
say so I think 2020 vision is definitely a good way to describe it. Hey, so what happened with you in 2020,
3:27
um, outside of, you know, I think everybody's, like, you know, the pandemic, and dealing with that, but, um, you know, I feel like, you know, I know, push and pivot and crossroads, mentioned, like, you know, I feel like every single moment, there is an element of Crossroads every single year, but 2020 was, what there is a true Crossroads outside of, you know, just aiming to stay safe. Aiming to stay safe. And I think like, one of the key things about 2020 was just like, being able to see what really matters. And I learned like to stop lying to myself. And yeah, just being being more real, being more real with myself. And that wasn't that wasn't a real, I mean, an easy thing to do. Um, but yeah, so long story short, I get those those 2020 Yeah.
4:25
Yeah, I can understand that. And when you say stop lying to yourself, like, what kind of things are you telling yourself?
4:32
Um, so for instance, I, like you know, I'll boil it to I'll say, like, one thing, for instance, like I was in I was in a relationship. And it was it was in a constant fixed mode, like we granted we really liked each other, meaning, you know, care for each other and so forth. But it was really in a constant fixed mode. And, you know, the woman I really I think I really cared for to one thing to work out but I was fighting with things with them. Myself, where I kept trying to be like, you know what, hey, like, I can, you know, just work through it and so forth. And, but deep down, I knew I was like, you know, you probably shouldn't be in this relationship like, not only just because you but you know, be better for her, and so forth. And, you know, it was not an easy thing to do to pull the trigger to end that. But like, you know, I mean, it was just accumulation of things, but, you know, from from a relationship to, you know, facing fears to, yeah, just knowing that, like, internal work is serious, very serious. So, I'm just being like, you know, hey, like, you don't, don't rely on this for happiness and like, under, like, when I say lying, like a relationship being in a relationship, because, you know, lying to yourself in the element of like, Hey, you know, maybe this could work, or just trying to, like, I'm the straight fixer mode, or, like, you know, I don't want to be alone, I'm scared to be alone. And all those things, like I was lying to myself. So even just like saying, I was just so mean, seeing it, it's weird, but it was the truth. So, learning to do when I say lying to myself, like learning and learning to, like, stop lying about things like to justify, and I'm still learning, but but like, and that was that that was definitely a big takeaway. 2020 for sure, that
6:20
sounds huge. I mean, to look at yourself, and realize that you can find your happiness within and realizing when you're not being true to yourself,
6:30
not an easy thing to do, not an easy thing to write
6:34
at all, not at all, what other things did, due to your eyes open up to in 2020
6:42
on a, you know, on a whole nother level, just being able to see understanding as a, you know, as a black man that we as a black community that we really need to heal, and that the, you know, the pandemic just was very, the pandemic really opened up the open up my eyes, and I think eyes of the world, just in the sense of like, you know, your job is not, you can't really depend on your job, things like that. And this is relating back to like the black community, and just dealing with four years of Trump and just dealing with, you know, George Floyd, Brianna, Taylor, Ahmad, arbory. These are like, you know, key names that are just like, coming off the top of their head, but, you know, for us to go through a pandemic, and the world to be on pause. And I mean, it's like, there's no sports, nothing going on. And, you know, to, to see everybody kind of react, like, you know, like, this is something new and kind of have like that reality check. That was kind of that was more or less, that felt like a slap in the face. And I say that in the sense of, they felt like, wow, like you, like people just really just like start realizing that we are getting killed, unarmed black people are being killed, and that black people will have been treated unfairly from, you know, from housing, to education, and so forth. Like, this is this like, this is this is what people are realizing now, when the whole world is on pause. That messed me up. So I caught like, not messed me, well, it just made me just like, it just triggered something. And just like, wow, like, you know, hey, I feel like, as opposed to us as a buy in the black community that we need to be asking, like, we're always asking and trying to show our worth and show our value. That, you know, the pandemic really showed me like, you know, it, you know, f that, like, we really just need to take time and just like heal ourselves, because there's so much trauma that we agreed that we're dealing with, that we really need to take the time to heal ourselves. And that kind of lead led to the inspiration of healing outdoors, hiking, meditate, you know, we were like, you know, but I mean, long story short, yeah. I can easily run off. No, this is,
9:02
I mean, we all lived through this. And it was very apparent once everything turned off. And it was very easy for people to kind of distract themselves with sports or distract yourself with anything, instead of really looking at what's happening each other as a whole. And even for ourselves within the community. I mean, it was you live every single day. And these things are staying in the back of your mind. But with nothing else going on. There is no like, I still have to go to work tomorrow. We're all there to have to confront our thoughts and what we're seeing on the television and what we really think so yeah, I think a lot of people can relate to your feeling.
9:52
I'm glad that like, I really didn't have only only had like one white person that will know somebody that I know Know, that reached out and was like, Hey, what do you think? What do you think I could like I could do to be better and stuff like that. I was just like, Wow. This is a as a high level of privilege. I said, I just say I'm glad that I didn't have like, you know, people come out the Woodworks and just start asking me like, what do you day? You know, what do you think I do? Yeah.
10:25
And then also like taking it back to what you said before about being able to see yourself, I'm sure that everyone had to look in the mirror a little bit differently. And as you said, that's really hard. So what have you been doing with taking meditate?
10:43
The funny thing is like so you know, one thing, hiking has been something that I've like, always had an interest in, but it's just something that was never really, it was something one of those things where it's like, you know, your friends don't want to do it. And it's like, you don't want to seem like the weirdo. And it didn't like I didn't I remember my first hike was like 2013. Fast forward to, you know, quarantine and stuff, just knowing that the gyms were shut off, and just knew like, being outside and getting in those moments, just being alone, or just like being alone, and being able to just explore has been like an element of peace for me. And I found that piece even more in midst of the pandemic. And one of my one of the co founders, too, as well, like, we've been doing this stuff, but we took a cross country road trip from, from Buffalo to Well, I mean, we went to LA but we also I mean, the whole key was right before my birthday, and it was a week long road trip. So that was kind of we were just like, you know, what, hey, we're literally traveling cross country, and the pandemic, as two black men free. Like, this is so powerful. And obviously, like we, I mean, like, we slept in the car and everything, like we currently camped in the car, and we just navigated through and we just adapted through everything, we went to a couple went to like three national parks, and so forth. But we just like, there was such an element of freedom and understanding what that could do, like being outside and hiking and how that could be like a form of healing. We wanted to, you know, spread that same energy out to others, because we really do need to heal. And we constantly find ourselves asking, asking and trying to validate who we are to white people, people who will never see us as humans, which is why a face such as Black Lives Matter exists. You know, it's like, you know, like, really think about it, like how ignorant Do you have to be to even be educated on that notion. Like, that's like saying, like, dogs Lives Matter. Like, I wouldn't eat like, you don't even need it. I don't even need to debate you on that. You know, but the thing is, like, it's so like, this trauma that we experienced as a community is so deep. And I just all that to say like, we just need to do the healing we, we need outlets and opportunity to, to to heal, because we've never had a chance to heal. Like we've never had the luxury to heal. So that's so that's I mean, all that to say, you know, hiking meditate is is an outlet.
13:22
Yeah. And when he talks about that freedom and expansiveness, you can see that through the pictures that you took, it just looks so peaceful. And I mean, I haven't been to any of those national parks out west, and it just looked amazing. And even the thought of traveling across country, I know that that's something we had talked about way back when, but scared to do it. And when you said that you were going I was like, oh my god. Like, oh, my goodness, where's he gonna be?
13:55
On your brother?
13:59
I'm sure that was just such a freeing feeling to just do that. While everything else is possible. You had the time and the space and to be able to think and be outside and feel like yourself.
14:13
That's most important. I'm still learning to be comfortable in my skin. Because we've for far too long we've had to reduce who we are. So like, we've had to reduce ourselves, whether it's the idea of code switching, and so forth, just just being free and just like, you know, why people are free, they can do whatever they want. And it's just like, well, I'm like, I'm free to and like, I don't want to change who I am to accommodate you or appease you just like, it doesn't mean I have to be disrespectful or anything like that. But yeah, yeah. being free for you being we are we are liberated people.
14:54
Yeah, you're free. Without that unconscious stress that Most of us don't even think about. But it happens all the time as your as your right people code switch or you, you're more aware of your surroundings. So being comfortable in your skin, I can totally understand. And I felt that. So have you invited other people to hike and meditate?
15:17
Oh, yeah, we've, we've done. I mean, so we've done we've done some group hikes. We've done some group hikes like our first one was actually collab with a collective black people who hike and which is a predominantly black woman. And, you know, they same same message to as well or it's like, you know, hey, work, we understand that, you know, the hiking outdoor community is underserved. But when it when it comes to look at seeing people that look like us, it's open to everybody. And this is a great place, and we should just, you know, we're opening up the door. So we actually ended up collabing with, with black people like in Atlanta. And it was so beautiful. So many beautiful women, too, as well. And we had a great time. And it was just like the energy it was it was a good, good, feminine and feminine and masculine energy. It was just it was beautiful. Like business businesses where they did it, they you know, we did a pretty, pretty dope thing. And then after that, we did another one. We did one in western New York, which was, which was great. And then I mean, we just we did a solo trip. And we were just in Puerto Rico. Oh, awesome. Yeah.
16:32
I didn't realize that was part of that, too. Where does the meditation come in?
16:38
Oh, so the meta the meditation part of the hike is usually it's like twofold. It's either a the very formal aspect of like, sitting first off meditating is like, there's so many different forms of meditating. And I think, like, the common misconception behind meditating is like, Oh, you got to sit down and like, boom, like, it's like, easy meditating is not easy. For anybody who's ever tried, I mean, just sitting down and just trying to be quiet while being quiet and just like, letting things flow and just try to act like you don't think of any other thoughts. That's not easy to do. But um, but it's just practice, like you know, that the meditating all that to say the meditating comes at the usually meditating takes two forms, one where it's like, you're actually walking and just being aware of the things that are around you, when you're hiking, whether it's the leaves the ground, watching your step, the stones that you step on, you know that that's a part of the meditation and then the more the formal aspect is like, you know, when we finish the hike, and then we sit down and just like have, you know, that that moment of reflection, one person, they are other, the other co founder, they run he used Zoo bees, the meditation, he usually does like a guided meditation, wherever we reach, like the summit, but it's either a, we do a guided one, you know, and just walking, walking everybody through or be, you know, just literally just sitting down, putting a putting a timer on the phone or whatever. And just, you know, just really being mindful of, of your breath, and closing your eyes, and just taking it all.
18:19
That's beautiful. And I'm really glad that you told everyone that there's different forms of meditation that just being out there and hiking is, is a form of meditation.
18:31
I take it hopefully, I don't know why I'm, I'm well sure that you watch them will be soul gifts. Yeah, and I think even a classic, classic, classic, like, even like, there was a moment when I'm, like, close to the end, he was sitting down, and like, that was a form of meditation when the, like a leaf fell down. And, you know, Joe, he caught the leaf. And like, I was like, wow, like that was just that form of mindfulness of just watching. So I understand that meditating is not an easy concept where people just think like, oh, like, I tried, it's hard. It's, you know, I just can't focus. You know, it's like, you know, you just work at your own pace, like, ya know, you'll have other thoughts. But, you know, that's, that's not a bad thing. That's not a bad thing. At least you're giving yourself that time to sit down and be quiet.
19:25
Yeah, I find that during meditation, that's when my mind is most expansive. And I think it's really important for people to know that there's so many ways that you can meditate that it's not, not like what we see on TV that you have to be sitting there and humming or something. There's so many ways of meditation and that that visual of soul that it's right on, it's right on. To me, this has been so nice. So if you could give someone one piece of advice, what would it be?
19:56
Um, if I could give somebody one piece of advice I would say I think I say how to fold a journal, I think journaling is a powerful thing. You know, being able to just write, get your thoughts down or just, you know, just just have been having a space where you could just be free. And just, you know, be unapologetic. And just like, you know, fresher thoughts and just having that space, I feel like that's a good, I would advise that to anybody. I recommend I've been journaling since officially since 2013. So I got a couple of journals stacked up. But outside of that, I would say, you know, the biggest piece of advice that take away the climate that we are in today is very nasty. And you it's like, it's this, you don't have the nobody has the privilege to sit back and not do anything. And meaning like it doesn't matter if you're if you're black or white to us as black people, we have the ability to have the privilege to ignore things, racism, and all that, and, and so forth is palatable for us today, in the sense where you can kind of navigate and be a little comfortable, but understand that it's still in your face, until it hits home. And until it hits you to a place where you really really feel it, like bad. Or so I'd say I feel like right now, I think one piece of advice that, uh, you know, white, black, whoever I feel that you really need to speak up, speak up, and, you know, beat your truth for it will lead to, you know, the betterment of humanity. Because we could easily look back in the history books today. And just see how whether it was like the 60s or 70s, and how things are very similar. You know, just dealing with four years of under the Trump era, and stuff. That's kind of like so that's, that's one piece of advice. I think, like, it doesn't matter. Like, I feel like everybody needs to everybody has to do their part. Because if you if you don't do anything, you're complacent. And you're only normalizing everything that has has transpired even though right now we have a new administration and all that. Even like we're still we're still you know, dealing with it. Yeah. So that's that's like that's like my rah rah rah answer. But outside of that, you know, learning piece of advice, like learning self is not easy. I think like, and being being honest with yourself, like being honest with your likes, and your with things that you like, and you don't like. Keep that goes for all categories of life, whether it's like, you know, friendships, relationships, you know, anything just like learning just to be honest, like, you know what, hey, I really don't like this thing. And even if it sounds shallow, or so forth, like understanding that you but it's not, it might not be shallow. But it's just it's how you truly feel and it's just authentically and honestly, you. So,
23:17
ah, so many gems. So how can people learn more about you
23:25
feel free, you know, Instagram is probably one of the best ways so. Oh, gee, Michael James. And, yeah, that's probably that's definitely like the best the best avenue to get in contact. You know, I do like, you know, messages or whatnot. DMS. Okay. That's, that's cool. I'm always always up for elevated conversations. So, so yeah,
23:52
yeah, hit me up. So I just want to thank you so much for coming on today. This was really awesome. Keep speaking up.
24:08
Thank you for having me.
24:11
While talking to Michael, the importance of taking time to self reflect, and learning to be comfortable with yourself kept coming up for me. It made me curious, do you take time to be with yourself? And when you do take that time, what are you doing? Is there a certain activity? Is there a feeling or do you have to be in a special location? I'd love to hear about it. Send me a message on Instagram at pusher pivot. Thank you for listening to the push or pivot podcast. If you enjoyed this episode, hit the subscribe button. And please leave us a review. To learn more about the show and to access the show notes. Visit our website, push or pivot.com. I'd also love to hear from you. Share your thoughts and takeaways with me on Instagram at pusher pivot. Thank you for listening, and join me next time on the push or pivot podcast.